On occasion, Dave Layfield, our founder and resident affordable housing expert, does a live video chat with our users
on Facebook. He usually spends an hour answering users’ questions about affordable housing assistance. Most of the time, he has the answer, but if he is unable to answer the question at the time, he will research the question after the chat and we will reach out to the user.
Following are the questions and Dave’s answers from the live video chat of Thursday, August 4, 2016. We have embedded the recording of the video chat for you to watch, and provided a transcript below.
Hi I'm David Layfield with Affordable Housing Online and today we're going to do my weekly talk show Affordable Housing Talk with Dave that we didn't do last week. Maybe it's not so weekly after all. No, I took a week off last week and I'm back now and happy to answer your questions.
I take user questions from anyone who has a question about housing, rental housing, Section Eight waiting lists, or any other technical questions you may have about renting. I can usually answer them on the fly, and if I can't I will. There's going to be a place where you can enter comments and just enter your questions there. We have someone that's monitoring. Nate's monitoring the comment feed and is going to feed questions to me as we go along.
I have several questions already that were asked before we went live and I will start answering those now. But again if you have a question about Section Eight or Affordable Housing or any other rental questions, go ahead and ask those in the comments and I will get to them at the end of the show. We figure this is going to take thirty to forty-five minutes usually and I’ll just go ahead and get started.
So first question: I'm disabled but I know someone who isn't, that got a voucher before me. Why is that?
So, though many housing authorities offer preferences for persons with disabilities, not every housing authority does. And on top of that, even if there is a housing authority that offers a preference for persons with disabilities, they may also offer preferences for other reasons. They may offer preferences for persons who are victims of domestic violence, they may offer a preference for veterans, or for seniors. And so persons with disabilities isn't the only group that about your preference may be granted to. So let's say that a Section Eight waiting list preference was granted for persons with disabilities, but they also have preferences for seniors and veterans and you weren't a senior veteran but you have a disability, but someone who was a senior and a veteran who didn't have a disability, they would actually have more preference points than you and be ranked higher on the waiting list. That's one possibility and of course the other possibility is that the housing authority waiting list they you're on didn't have any sort of preference of persons with disabilities. So don't just automatically assume because you have a disability that you're going to be in front of other folks. So hopefully that answered your question.
Ok, on to the next question: I was called to be told I have a voucher but I have to go to their office for a meeting. I don't live there and it's hard for me to travel. What can I do?
So, whenever you apply for a waiting list, make sure that when it's time for you to receive a voucher that you can actually get there for the entrance interview there. You know, the housing authorities aren't going to just mail you a voucher. You have to come into the office and sit down with a caseworker in almost all cases, I'm not sure I've ever heard of a housing authority not having you come into their office for an entrance interview and to process the final paperwork. So you need to make sure that when you do apply for a voucher waitlist that you know that you're going to be able to get there. Because you have to use that voucher in that place anyway, so what can I do?
You need to, ya know if you want to use that voucher, you need to figure out how to get there for that interview and you also need to remember that voucher, you're going to have to use that voucher in that place. So you're going to have to eventually get there anyway, so there's a not of whole lot you can do. If you want access to that voucher, you're going to have to figure out how to get there for that entrance interview. And a lot of times they don't give you a lot of notice. They may schedule it, they may not give you a choice. They may say "we need you here a week from Tuesday at three o'clock in the afternoon" and they don't give you an option. So you need to figure out how to get there. If it requires a flight or cross-country drive, that might be difficult to pull off so think about that when you're actually applying for a waiting list across the country or far away.
Ok, next question: I didn't qualify because I make too much. Does this mean I wouldn't qualify anywhere?
No, it doesn't. And it also doesn't mean that, in the place that you are, that you wouldn't qualify for some other housing program. So we have many different housing assistance programs in this country. You have the Section Eight housing choice voucher program, but you also have programs like the Low Income Housing tax credit or project based Section Eight or HUD section two hundred and two and eight-eleven and USDA section five hundred and fifteen. There's all these different programs, and many of them have different income requirements. It's not always the same as, let's say, the Section Eight Housing Choice Voucher waitlist. So in Section Eight, the housing authority is usually required to try and serve a disproportionate amount of folks that are at thirty percent of the area median income, which is very low income, whereas in the Long-term Housing Tax Credit program, they may have far more affordable units available to folks who earn sixty percent of the area median income. So it does vary from program to program in each place.
There's another way it varies, and that is from place to place the amount of income that you have to earn, or less, can vary from place to place because the cost of living in a rural town in Texas is significantly less than the cost of living in New York City or somewhere in the mid-Atlantic, for example, in a suburban market. So, though you may make too much in one city, if your income wouldn't change that much, let's say let's say you're earning the minimum wage and the amount the amount of money you earn in your current town versus the amount of money you earn in your new town aren't much different, well it could be that the income qualification amount you're required to earn could be different. So it could be that in your current town you make too much money but in another town you don't. So what you have to do there, is you have to look at what your income is, or what your income will be, in the new place and then figure out what the income requirements are for the various programs for that place as well. How do you find that out?
Well fortunately, Affordable Housing Online, our website, has lots of great information about all the various programs and it has income qualification information about every city and county in America. All you have to do is go to Affordablehousingonline.com and in that search box, type in your city and state, your county and state, and you're going to come to a page for that city or county with all sorts of information. You know the inc-, you know, how much income for your family size you need to earn, that amount or less, to qualify for various programs. So hopefully that helps.
Ok, moving on to the next question: It's been two years since I applied and I haven't heard anything. What's going on?
Well probably, what's going on is the status quo. That's actually what tends to happen. It is that when you apply for Section Eight Housing Choice Voucher waiting list, or some other housing assistance waiting list, it takes years. It takes years. Sometimes waiting lists stay closed for five or ten years. So if you apply two years ago you're probably still on the waiting list, it's just that the waiting list is so long and there's so little turn over. There so few people leaving the program, there's no new money to serve incoming people. Therefore, you know, it's a very long process, has a very long wait to get down the waiting list to you. So first of all, you have to be patient and find a way to make housing affordable in between. But you should also make sure that you are still on that waiting list, and that's one thing that you should be concerned about.
Because, and two years isn't a very long time, but housing authorities regularly go through a purging process to make sure that they have a current waiting list. So they will send a letter or an email out to everyone on their waiting list. Give you, say, two weeks to respond and say "yes, this contact information is correct, and I still want to be on the waiting list". And that keeps you on the waiting list. But if you don't respond at all, then that gives them the right to remove you. So, it could be that that happened a year ago and you've been waiting two years and think you're on the waiting list, but in actuality they removed you a year ago.
So you need to make sure that you are on that waiting list. You can contact the housing authority by phone, by email, or sometimes many housing authorities have an online portal through your website where you can check the status, your status, where you are to make sure you're still on that waiting list. So anyway two years, not that long to wait. And again, I recommend you be patient, and then, in the meantime, continue looking for housing assistance in other, you know, other nearby places. You know, consider various different programs, don't focus just on the Housing Choice Voucher Program. There are other housing programs, there's other affordable housing communities in your area that have subsidies that can help you with your housing needs that don't have as long of a wait. And again, you can find that information on our website at Affordablehousingonline.com.
Alright, so looks like this is my last question from before we started. And I'm checking to see... I've got a couple more questions that came in while we've been talking. I'll get to those in a minute. So here's my last question from before the video started and then we'll get to those three, but...: My mom has to move in so I can take care of her, and I have Section Eight. Can she live with me?
Yes absolutely, she can. You are the recipient of the Section Eight. You're the head of household, right? So you're entitled to have household changes. You're entitled to add persons to your household, you're entitled to remove persons from your household, you know. You can, you know, get married, or have a baby, or get divorced, or you know, a member of your household may pass away. Household composition changes. As long as the head of household, which I'm assuming you are, doesn't change, the rest of the household can shift around. However, you have to let the housing authority know those changes, because what happens is your income changes, right?
So, if your mom has any income, if she has retirement income or social security income which she likely does, that's going to be added onto your income qualification. Now, your household size will go up, so if it's just you, and now it's her, then there's two of you, and so the income table goes with the two-person household income. But you still have to factor her income in to make sure you're eligible. So one thing that you really need to think about, and my recommendation is to just call the housing authority to, you know... But first of all find out how much your mom earns. You know, what's her gross take home from her? Any retirement benefits, and then have that number when you talk to the housing authority. You know, give them that income number and make sure that you still qualify, because what you don't want is for your mom to move in, and then all of a sudden you make too much to receive voucher assistance, and then they take away your voucher. That...you don't want that to happen. But absolutely, you can change the composition of your household, as long as you remain below the income qualification requirements for Section Eight voucher, you can do that.
Ok, so I'm going to go ahead and start with the new questions that came in when, after we started and Dawn says, asks: Isn't their program for Section Eight for low-income people to help to buy a house?
And, yes I get this question pretty frequently, and there is a way to buy a home using a Section Eight voucher but it's fairly rare. And in fact there are only certain housing authorities can do this and there aren't that many of them. I want to think there's forty or fifty housing authorities in the country that have authorization from HUD to do homeownership vouchers. It's a specific kind of voucher, and I think Nate if you would post a link? I know we've posted a link before to the HUD page that talks about homeownership vouchers. Because it's so rare, I don't have a lot of expertise in that subject, but there's a page on HUD's website that has all the information about it, Dawn, so I would just go there and research to see if it might be an option for you.
Okay, Ayla asks: Does the AMI of a neighborhood cause your rent to go up?
So AMI is area median income and, it's not based on neighborhood, it's based on a metropolitan statistical area. So for example, Baltimore has an AMI, an area median income for, not for the city and then for the surrounding counties. The same thing with New York, the metropolitan area, you know Los Angeles, San Francisco. There is area median income, it's established for each of those and so it's not on a neighborhood basis. But, let's say that the AMI does go up from one year to the next for your area, it's not really going to impact how much money you pay in rent because your rent is usually determined by what your income is, and your income doesn't usually change because the AMI changes. So you're going to be paying thirty percent of your income towards the rent. Well, your income again is independent of that AMI. What AMI does do, when it goes up, is, perhaps, changes the rent standards that the housing authority uses when determining whether or not a rental that you bring to them that you want to use your voucher on is acceptable. So the housing authority says, you know "you can use your voucher for three bedroom apartments that rent for as much as X". Well, if the area median income goes up, then usually that rent standard amount will go up as well in reaction to that, so... And then also if it does go down, and we have seen AMIs go down, and in many markets since the crash or at least stay stagnant, then you might actually see that the payment standard that you're allowed to have to pay in rent using the voucher could actually go down. But usually your tenant contribution isn't going to go down because that's based on thirty percent of your income.
Ok, next question, to Cora: What do you do if you have a voucher and you are having difficulty finding a place in the time frame?
Extremely common question and this is a big problem and it's a growing problem in the U.S. because more and more landlords are refusing to accept vouchers. And we've written about this. It's to a point now where there's actually many jurisdictions that are enacting legislation to make it illegal for landlords to not rent to people with Section Eight vouchers. It's called source of income discrimination. Nate, if you would post a link to our source of income discrimination page where we have all those resources. But it's a common problem. In all likelihood, you are in a place where it is legal for a landlord to discriminate against someone who has a Section Eight voucher. So what do you do when housing authority says when they give you a new voucher and they say you have sixty days, or you have ninety days to find a rental. If you don't find a rental in that sixty to ninety days, you lose your voucher. Which, by the way, happens to many, many people. They wait five years for a voucher, and then they get a voucher and then they can't find a rental and sixty to ninety days that will accept it, and then they have to give it back.
This is very, it's very, very common in some markets. I read... like Chattanooga, Tennessee. Two-thirds of new voucher recipients lose their voucher when first getting it because they can't find a landlord that will accept the voucher. What do you do? Well, a couple of things. I would suggest first of all if you think that you might be getting close to the top of the waiting list, and you might be getting a voucher soon, then start your search right away, you know? You start looking as soon as possible, you need to be ready. And when that clock starts to tick, when that sixty days or ninety days, whatever your housing authority gives you when it starts to tick, you need to already be actively searching. You have you need to have a plan, a strategy for how you're going to find that rental. You know, especially once you know you're getting a voucher, don't wait, don't procrastinate. Don't think that, you know, you can wait till the last Saturday in that two month period to go and find a place and walk in and then rent it. It's not that easy, especially when you're trying to use a voucher to pay your rent in these markets where it's allowed for a landlord to discriminate against voucher holders. So, one thing, be proactive.
Make sure that you're looking early, and you're working really hard early on to find those rentals. Another thing that you really should do, is prepare yourself for having to ask for an extension. And, you know, the way to do that is keep a log of your search. Always write down every landlord you talk to you. If you call them and they say "sorry, we don't accept Section Eight", write down the landlord's name, the address of the house, their phone number, what they said when you called, when you called, you know the date and time you called them. The same thing if you email them over Craigslist. If you're searching on Craigslist and you find five and they all say "Section Eight not accepted", write each one of those down in your log. You know the address of the house, Section Eight not accepted, because when you go to ask for an exception and almost every housing authority will give you, not an exception, an extension, sorry. They will give you an extension of time after that sixty or ninety days. They'll give you another thirty days or so but they want proof that you were proactive, like I said. That you've been working on it and that you just didn't sit around and waste all of your time.
Well what's the best way to do that? Show them the log of activity show, them that "Hey, I started looking on the very first day, and here's my notes and, you know, I've been looking for a month". Also, when you see, you know, a few weeks into your search that this is a very difficult thing to do and you start getting concerned that you're not going to be able to find a rental by the time the sixty days is up, then you need to call the housing authority then. You need to tell them "Hey, I'm having a problem finding a landlord that will rent to me". That puts them on notice, number one, you might need an extension later on, but at the same time, they may have some tips for you. They may know of some landlords that are willing to accept Section Eight. But just make sure you're communicating with the housing authority and your caseworker. Let them know you're having a problem. They don't want to hear from you on day sixty, the day before your voucher expires, saying "Yeah, by the way I couldn't find a rental. Can you give me an extension for a month?". That, you know, they want to hear from you before that. Some places, some tips on places to find a land that will accept the voucher.
There's a website called gosection8.com and there are, it is pretty much all private home individual rental landlords that are willing to accept Section Eight. And then also remember that any apartment community that is federally financed, the Low Income Housing tax credit project and other types of HUD projects are required to accept your voucher under federal law. If they're receiving any other sort of federal housing financing they are also required to accept your voucher. A good way to find those is on our website. Go to Affordablehousingonline.com, type in your city and state, your county and state, and you're going to come up with a list of properties that are in our database. And all of these properties in our database are properties that are receiving federal housing assistance. They all, now these are apartment communities, they're not individual homes for the most case, you know, they're buildings of eight or twelve or fifty or a hundred apartments but they're all required to accept your voucher. And, you know, so maybe your point, a month into your search, when you can't find that dream house maybe you punt and go look for an apartment in the denser apartment community that is one to accept the voucher. Ok, there's a long answer but it's also a very complicated question. Hopefully that was helpful.
Ok, Shante asks: How can you get housing quick in a different state?
When you say "How can you get housing quick?", I'm assuming you mean 'how can you get housing assistance?' or 'how can you find subsidized housing, more affordable housing quickly in a different place from where you currently are?' and I don't think that, first of all, it's pretty hard to find housing assistance quickly anywhere, whether it's in your hometown or all the way across the country. But the quick part, you know, is not the Section Eight waiting list. You're not going to find a Section Eight waiting list that you can get housing assistance quickly right? It's going to be more likely, it's going to be more likely a long-term housing tax credit property or ... you're gonna have to hit the button it didn't work. Now it's going to be... sorry about that, technical difficulties, yeah that worked.
Sorry! Ok, camera problems.
A long-term housing tax credit property is often going to have openings. You might find a project based Section Eight property that has openings that doesn't have a long waiting list that you can move in too quickly. But the Section Eight waiting list is probably not going to be the answer to move somewhere else quickly. So again, I was just talking about and my answer to the last question is a good place to find that information is right here at Affordablehousingonline.com. Type in the city and state of the place where you want to move to and we have a list. Yeah, there'll be a list of properties there that are federally financed and usually you should be able to find something. Yeah, it's not gonna be free rent. They're usually, you know, the ones that have open waiting lists or no waiting list at all aren't usually income based rents. They're normal rents that you're going to have to pay but you should still be able to find something.
Ok, all right, last question. Wait, there's lots more questions. Ok, Shiree asks: Do you have to be a resident of that county to be qualified? I am in Florida but want to go to South Carolina closer to family.
No, you do not, in any case, in any housing program in the US. You don't have to be a resident of that county to utilize that housing program. Now, with the Housing Choice Voucher Section Eight waiting lists, there are usually, not usually, maybe half the time housing authorities employ something called a residency preference. They're not technically allowed to restrict you from applying to the program based on you being from a different place, but they can give preference to folks who are from that place. So you want to move to South Carolina, you're in Florida, that waiting list opens up in South Carolina. You can apply there, but if they have a local residency preference, the folks that live in that city are going to be ranked higher than you on the waiting list and be served before you. Again, feels like about half of all waiting list openings have local residency preferences. If there isn't a local residency preference, then they're going to, you know, you're ranked along with everyone whether they live there or not. And then when it comes to, you know, project based Section Eight property with its own waiting list that is separate apart from the Housing Choice voucher waiting list or Low Income Housing tax credit community, there is no residency requirement. There's no restriction, there's no local residency preferences either. You know, you're going on that waiting list just like everyone else and it doesn't matter where you currently live.
Well, excuse me. Alright, Latoya asks: Does your voucher amount change if moving to a different city?
It can if you're moving to a higher cost area or lower cost area, then that voucher amount's going to get adjusted. So the amount of the rent that is allowed to be charged by the landlord depends completely upon that particular house. That, you know, the bedroom size of that house and the location of that house. So if you currently live in a low-rent city and then you move on halfway across the country to a high-rent city then the voucher will change when you port that voucher. The same when you go the other direction. So the voucher amount isn't going to change. Now, sorry it is going to change. If your income doesn't change, let's say let's say you work as a virtual assistant and your income is consistent, you're being paid X dollars for doing the work no matter where you live. So your income isn't going to change whether you live in rural Texas or Manhattan, then though the voucher amount might change because you're going from a low-rent district to a high-rent district, the amount of your tenant contribution portion, how much you pay toward the rent wouldn't change it all because your income didn't change. If your income changes then your tenant contribution will also change and many cases when you do move from one place to another and there is a big discrepancy between housing costs there's also likely going to be a discrepancy between your income. You're probably, if you're moving to a higher rent-district from a low-rent district, you're probably going to be earning more too. And vice versa.
Ok, Roberto asks: This is only for women? I've applied in so many states. I'm homeless, receive SSI and get nothing.
Roberto, no it is not only for women. There is no housing program that specifically says that only women may benefit from it. So very, very simply, no. Men and women both qualify for the Section Eight Housing Choice voucher program, for Low Income Housing tax credit properties. For any federal housing program men and women qualify equally. Now, if you're homeless then you... that, many times, is a preference whether it be for public housing or the Housing Choice Voucher program. If you're currently homeless or at risk of becoming homeless, you need to let them know when you do your waiting list application because that will usually bump you up the list a bit. So keep at it, you will get assistance. It's not that you're not getting assistance because you're a man.
Ok, Tyrone. Tyrone asks: What should be done if a person was passed over on the waiting list because the place they had just found a mere day before their name came up wasn't approved? The place they found didn't meet housing criteria so they went on to the next name.
So that it doesn't make a lot of sense to me because when you get called and told that you qualify for a voucher and you're going to be issued a voucher they don't say "But do you have a rental ready? And if you don't, we're gonna go to the next person". They give you sixty to ninety days to find a rental once they tell you that your name is up on the waiting list so that doesn't make complete sense to me as to why. Housing authorities just don't function like that. They don't pass over someone on the waiting list and go to the next person because you don't have a rental ready. Now, if they did the paperwork, they called you in for the interview, they issued you a voucher, and sixty days went by and you couldn't find one or you did the day before it expired and it didn't qualify then you could have lost that voucher. But it's not that they're passing you over for it. So, I hope that helps. You might want to talk to the housing authority to get more detail on actually why that happened.
Ok, I got one, two, three more questions. Gene asked: Do you get a preference for a voucher if you work in that town?
So, sometimes yes and that's what I was talking about before. It's called a local residency preference. If you live, or you work... oh, and you actually asked for work. So there is something called a local residency and a local work preference and they're usually coupled together. So, on about half of the waiting list openings that we see are employee and local residency preference and it says if you live or you work in that city, then you're going to be ranked at the top of the list before others. And so you need to be able to document that you're working, that you currently work in that town and you can't like, go get a job this afternoon. You have to prove that you've been working there. Many housing authorities are going to actually have a certain amount of time you have to have worked in the town to qualify for that and I think, if I'm not mistaken, that can be... that can vary from housing authority to housing authority. It's up to them to establish how long you have to have been working there or living there, but yes. The answer to your question is you can get a preference for working in that town, but again, it's up to each housing authority to utilize that preference or not.
Ok, second to last question. Oh, looks like we've got another one coming from Jerome, so I still have three questions to go. Keyshia: My name was passed up on the waiting list because I moved. But I let them know I moved and they still sent my mail to my old address. What can I do?
That's unfortunate, but if you're going to attempt to be restored on the waiting list, the only thing I can think of is that you have to prove that you notified them and they somehow made a mistake. That means that, you know, when you say you notified them that you moved, do you have evidence of that? You know, do you have a copy of a letter? Do you have a copy of an email? Is there a specific form that they required of you that you completed and you have a copy of? You need to be able to prove that you notified them. If you just called them up and said "Hey I moved, my new addresses is this" and that staff person, they screwed up or that change never got saved in the computer system and you don't have a way to prove that, then there's... I don't think you have any recourse there. So, you know, make sure when you are updating your contact information that you have some sort of paper trail that you did so. You know, the best thing to do is to spend the four or five dollars on a green certified mailing at the post office. I think it's like five bucks. So the housing authority, when you send them a letter saying my address has changed, they have to sign for it and then you get back the green card that says they signed for it. That's proof "Hey, this is the proof. You accepted this letter on such-and-such a date that that my address has changed". Or an email, maybe an old email correspondence with a staff member and don't just send them an email saying that my address changed. Ask them to confirm with an email back to you that the address has changed and then that way if for some reason you removed from the waiting list and then they say "Well, we have your old address", then you can say "Well, actually on this date I changed it, and here's the paperwork to reflect it.
Ok, next question. Robyn: What options are there for families with kids with a disability?
So I talked, I think it's actually the very first question we talked about, heads of household with disabilities and that's a little bit different from families with children with disabilities. So, there aren't that many programs that I know of that actually provide housing for families that include children that have disabilities. There's plenty of housing out there that is handicapped accessible that's available to any family that has a member that's disabled, but housing programs specifically for persons that have disabled children don't really exist. So I would recommend that you at least, you know, take advantage of the fact that there are handicapped accessible units if you're if you have a handicapped child that has a physical disability that, say they're in a wheelchair, or they have some other disability. There are, you know, many how affordable housing communities today and more and more today are equipped for persons with disabilities and they're specifically set aside for persons with disabilities and you'll have access to them. But there aren't any specific... usually there aren't any specific programs for families that have children with disabilities.
Ok, second to last question. Oh wait, nope last question. All right, Joanne asks: If you were living with someone, can you apply as homeless?
Well probably, if you're only living with them because you're homeless and they're being kind and lending you their couch, then technically by definition you're still homeless. If you're not on the lease. If they write a letter to you saying "Hey, you know, in my graciousness, you're welcome to sleep on my couch for the next month but this is a short term until you can sort your life out", then technically, by definition, by the industry definition you are still homeless. Just make sure that you're properly documenting that, and you know, get your friend or your family member, whoever, that you're not a member of the household to write it down on a piece of paper and just... It can be a handwritten letter saying to Robyn or to Joanne, you know "You're welcome to use my couch for the next month, I want to help you get back on your feet but this is only a temporary situation" and if you do that then that's enough documentation to show housing authority or other housing provider that you are actually currently homeless and they would they would regard that as defined homeless.
Ok, last question. Feesa, hopefully I didn't butcher your name too much, asked: How long can a person be on a waiting list?
Well, the answer to that question is as open-ended as an unlimited amount of time. Honestly, there... you know, the New York City Housing Authority waiting list has been closed for like fifteen years or something, and there's people that have been on that waiting list for fifteen years. There is really no limit to how long you can be on a waiting list. It all depends upon how quickly that housing authority is able to move through the list and again, in many urban markets, big cities those lists are very long. So the answer to the question is it can be they can be for a very long time.
Ok so forty-one minutes today, forty-one minutes of Q&A. Thanks everyone for joining me, thanks for posting those questions. If you have more questions that you would like for me to ask answer next week, post them in the comments below. Even after this event, this live video event it has passed. It's going to be playing on our Facebook page for the next week and just go ahead and post your questions in the comments below and we'll make sure to get those questions first on next week when we go live. All right, again I'm David Layfield with Affordable Housing Online and this was 'Housing Talk with Dave'. If you have, if you're looking for affordable housing, always come visit us at Affordablehousingonline.com. In that big search box, enter the place that you're looking for and I'm sure we're going to have some information that's going to help you. Alright, thanks and have a good day!
